Unruffled is, at least to me, pretty clearly just referring to authoritarian states by the ML’s own preferred term, not suggesting it’s genuinely a socialist state. This reading seems to be confirmed by being directly followed up with a recommendation to ban communities that support those states instead of whole defederation.
I don’t think it’s terribly controversial that .world and SJW does tend to generate the majority of reported users besides drive-by accounts on poorly moderated instances, if only by virtue of both of them being the biggest instances.
Not to say I haven’t had reports for .ml users either, but their stance isn’t unreasonable.
I would’ve bought that a few months ago, but considering that Unruffled has since done a 180 on such issues like “Does Critical Support for the PRC make someone a tankie?”, I’m disinclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. Using the preferred terminology of tankies when not talking to tankies, and when talking to someone who is anti-tankie in a bid to get them to accept tankies, is extremely questionable. Saying that the frequency is greater also suggests that it’s not absolute size of problematic users that’s being discussed.
That they assert that anarchists should have more in common with a red fascist instance than ‘liberal’ instances (which are far to the left of what most actual liberals would accept) is also telling.
Also, considering Hexbear’s extremely aggressive posture, trying to portray them as ‘less problematic’ than .world or SJW is extremely questionable.
I would’ve bought that a few months ago, but considering that Unruffled has since done a 180 on such issues like “Does Critical Support for the PRC make someone a tankie?”, I’m disinclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. Using the preferred terminology of tankies when not talking to tankies, and when talking to someone who is anti-tankie in a bid to get them to accept tankies, is extremely questionable. Saying that the frequency is greater also suggests that it’s not absolute size of problematic users that’s being discussed.
That they assert that anarchists should have more in common with a red fascist instance than ‘liberal’ instances (which are far to the left of what most actual liberals would accept) is also telling.
Also, considering Hexbear’s extremely aggressive posture, trying to portray them as ‘less problematic’ than .world or SJW is extremely questionable.
But I’m sure the commenter who has ‘never seen a tankie’ on Lemmy and constantly licks Russian imperialist boots and plays apologist for Ukrainian genocide is posting entirely in good faith. :)
And SJW has .ml federated, so I guess Goat is a Tankie too.
Edit: using your own logic is offensive now, got it. I’ll make sure to never try to reason with you. I forgot centrists find being called a communist worse than being called a fascist, as they align closer to that. Explains why they defended the “tankie degenerate roach” user for so long.
Monthly, lemmy.zip and hexbear both have 1700 monthly active users , dbzer0 is at 1500
But what does the size of the instance even has to do in this conversation? Maga.place got defederated by LW, SJW, Blahaj, etc and it was a 5 users instance at the time.
Shouldn’t everyone defederate from hilariouschaos? Shouldn’t everyone defederate from Hexbear? Shouldn’t everyone defederate with lemmygrad? These are all extremist instances that don’t care for discussion or the fediverse.
Don’t bother. Blaze is an energy vampire who thinks being called names is admin abuse, but admins banning people for disagreeing with tankies is a-okay.
Weird how they can’t answer this but Pug called you the time vampire. Despite never answering your questions honestly. Shocked you’re not banned yet for asking questions.
Weird how they can’t answer this but Pug called you the time vampire. Despite never answering your questions honestly. Shocked you’re not banned yet for asking questions.
When did Blaze ask me any questions in this thread?
Anarchists have more in common from the fact that liberals support a capitalist framework alone. Tankies support socialism via weird means that don’t get there in the end.
One wants to do something similar, one defends capitalism. One wants to stop fascists, one defends fascists.
disagree. in my opinion anarchists and liberals have kind of the same goal, freedom for the people, but with very different means. all the while for tankies that’s not important at all, as we can see with how they cheer up on china and russia, surveillance states where your life can get destroyed for wrongthink.
Capitalism in decay turns into authoritarianism, as the state becomes part of the market system.
Authoritarianism is bad, by fascists, capitalists, and states pretending to be socialist/communist.
Edit: if this place doesn’t like extremism, why am I being downvoted for saying extremism is a bad thing and we need to avoid it? Did I call out a method of it that you agree with, like .ml and .world?
Tankies are morons who have the right intentions but the wrong idea how to get it. They read Marx and saw Stalin and went “sure that seems good.”
Liberals haven’t read Marx, saw Stalin and went “anything he stood for was evil.” And they’re mostly right, but they have the wrong intentions with the new ways of avoiding it. All of which lead to Trump’s iron grip.
Tankies are morons who have the right intentions but the wrong idea how to get it. They read Marx and saw Stalin and went “sure that seems good.”
“They read Marx and missed his point entirely, instead embracing fascism, therefore, they’re better than people who haven’t read Marx.”
Liberals haven’t read Marx, saw Stalin and went “anything he stood for was evil.” And they’re mostly right, but they have the wrong intentions with the new ways of avoiding it. All of which lead to Trump’s iron grip.
What exactly is the fucking difference, then, between tankies and liberals in this conception in terms of where it leads to?
“Tankies are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism” in this conception, which acknowledges that tankies are aiming for Stalin-esque bureaucratic control of the means of production, is no more coherent than “Strasserists are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism”, or “Theocratic clientists are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism” - the latter, bizarrely enough, being something I have actually heard tankies on Lemmy espouse. Apparently the whole fascist conception of a “third way” was lost on them - or worse, appears appealing.
You could just as easily say “Liberals are morons who have the right intentions (democracy) but the wrong idea how to get it (capitalism)”
Tankies are dumbasses who simp for dictators, liberals have more intelligence but apply it incorrectly.
Most liberals are liberal for lack of a better idea. Most liberals have not even been exposed to serious conceptions of socialism. If given the choice between fighting with liberals or fighting with tankies to see the point of a democratic and socialist society, liberals are by far the easier fight.
For that matter, if given the choice between fighting with a liberal regime, whose insufficient opposition to authoritarianism is likely to result in an eventual capitulation to fascism; or a tankie regime, which is and has its goal as fascism painted red; the former is much easier to fight and organize in.
Of those two choices - and the real world is not composed of such a binary - I would argue, albeit admittedly as a demsoc rather than an outright anarchist - that anarchists, whom I disagree with moderately at most, shouldn’t have anything in common with fucking tankies, who are despicable. If ‘opposition to capitalism’ is a valid point of ‘agreement’ then, as I pointed out, literal fascist regimes are no less ‘allies’ in that conception in contrast to the liberal menace.
Unruffled is, at least to me, pretty clearly just referring to authoritarian states by the ML’s own preferred term, not suggesting it’s genuinely a socialist state. This reading seems to be confirmed by being directly followed up with a recommendation to ban communities that support those states instead of whole defederation.
I don’t think it’s terribly controversial that .world and SJW does tend to generate the majority of reported users besides drive-by accounts on poorly moderated instances, if only by virtue of both of them being the biggest instances.
Not to say I haven’t had reports for .ml users either, but their stance isn’t unreasonable.
I would’ve bought that a few months ago, but considering that Unruffled has since done a 180 on such issues like “Does Critical Support for the PRC make someone a tankie?”, I’m disinclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. Using the preferred terminology of tankies when not talking to tankies, and when talking to someone who is anti-tankie in a bid to get them to accept tankies, is extremely questionable. Saying that the frequency is greater also suggests that it’s not absolute size of problematic users that’s being discussed.
That they assert that anarchists should have more in common with a red fascist instance than ‘liberal’ instances (which are far to the left of what most actual liberals would accept) is also telling.
Also, considering Hexbear’s extremely aggressive posture, trying to portray them as ‘less problematic’ than .world or SJW is extremely questionable.
Yeah, if you read what was written then the thread title doesn’t make much sense.
Now why the hell would I read past the title?
Reading past the title is for Tankies!
Yeah but why would you want to look at the context, Pug did it for us! …just don’t look, it might prove him wrong.
But I’m sure the commenter who has ‘never seen a tankie’ on Lemmy and constantly licks Russian imperialist boots and plays apologist for Ukrainian genocide is posting entirely in good faith. :)
Weird though, since Dbzer0 federates with Hexbear, which unilaterally supports authoritarianism
Isn’t SJW federating with .ml?
Yes, but Hexbear and .ml are very different.
Removed by mod
But you can be anti-tankie on lemmy.ml, you can’t on Hexbear
Ehhhhh, sorta.
Except for all the posts removing anything tankies disagree with, that are posted here. Clearly you can’t be anti-tankie there. So defed from them.
Edit: So you ain’t gonna defend from them, gotcha. You like Tankies then, since you clearly refuse to advocate to be defend from them.
Lemmy.zip is federated with hexbear too, what does it make lemmy.zip ?
Lemmy.world is still federated with hilariouschaos - https://piefed.world/post/488105
Does this make Lemmy.world align with HC stances?
And SJW has .ml federated, so I guess Goat is a Tankie too.
Edit: using your own logic is offensive now, got it. I’ll make sure to never try to reason with you. I forgot centrists find being called a communist worse than being called a fascist, as they align closer to that. Explains why they defended the “tankie degenerate roach” user for so long.
That’s offensive
Hexbear is larger than dbzer0 and lemmy.zip
Hilariouschaos is much smaller than world
1300, 1200, 1100 weekly active users
Monthly, lemmy.zip and hexbear both have 1700 monthly active users , dbzer0 is at 1500
But what does the size of the instance even has to do in this conversation? Maga.place got defederated by LW, SJW, Blahaj, etc and it was a 5 users instance at the time.
You tell me what it has to do with the conversation, you brought up hilariouschaos in response to Hexbear.
Either way, dbzer0 and lemmy.zip should defederate from Hexbear, no?
Are you going to tell every single instance federated with hexbear that they should defederate with hexbear?
You were the first one using the “instances which are federated with hexbear are suspicious” argument in this comment
Yes.
Shouldn’t everyone defederate from hilariouschaos? Shouldn’t everyone defederate from Hexbear? Shouldn’t everyone defederate with lemmygrad? These are all extremist instances that don’t care for discussion or the fediverse.
Don’t bother. Blaze is an energy vampire who thinks being called names is admin abuse, but admins banning people for disagreeing with tankies is a-okay.
Weird how they can’t answer this but Pug called you the time vampire. Despite never answering your questions honestly. Shocked you’re not banned yet for asking questions.
I did answer?
Questioning also doesn’t get you banned in this community, unlike so many others
When did Blaze ask me any questions in this thread?
Lord.
It’s a distraction after you proved Goat wrong, yet again. And then he moves the goal posts, again.
You mean PugJesus is taking things out of context, lying about the context, and spreading it knowingly? I’m sure that’s never happened before.
the first sentence of unruffled says a lot, with or without context.
Anarchists have more in common from the fact that liberals support a capitalist framework alone. Tankies support socialism via weird means that don’t get there in the end.
One wants to do something similar, one defends capitalism. One wants to stop fascists, one defends fascists.
disagree. in my opinion anarchists and liberals have kind of the same goal, freedom for the people, but with very different means. all the while for tankies that’s not important at all, as we can see with how they cheer up on china and russia, surveillance states where your life can get destroyed for wrongthink.
Oh indeed, anarchists are more about freedom. It’s why I detest tankies.
Does capitalism breed fascism?
Capitalism in decay turns into authoritarianism, as the state becomes part of the market system.
Authoritarianism is bad, by fascists, capitalists, and states pretending to be socialist/communist.
Edit: if this place doesn’t like extremism, why am I being downvoted for saying extremism is a bad thing and we need to avoid it? Did I call out a method of it that you agree with, like .ml and .world?
Pretending is an interesting term. You think there’s states pretending to be communist? Which ones?
China, the Soviet Union, Cuba. North Korea used to, until its Juche reform in like 2019 (?) completely gave up on it.
Communism requires no state. A state claiming ot be communist is an oxymoron.
so what’s your take on tankies then?
“Tankies support socialism via fascism!”
Average red fash bootlicker.
Removed by mod
Tankies are morons who have the right intentions but the wrong idea how to get it. They read Marx and saw Stalin and went “sure that seems good.”
Liberals haven’t read Marx, saw Stalin and went “anything he stood for was evil.” And they’re mostly right, but they have the wrong intentions with the new ways of avoiding it. All of which lead to Trump’s iron grip.
That seems a little US-centric
“They read Marx and missed his point entirely, instead embracing fascism, therefore, they’re better than people who haven’t read Marx.”
What exactly is the fucking difference, then, between tankies and liberals in this conception in terms of where it leads to?
“Tankies are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism” in this conception, which acknowledges that tankies are aiming for Stalin-esque bureaucratic control of the means of production, is no more coherent than “Strasserists are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism”, or “Theocratic clientists are better than liberals because they oppose capitalism” - the latter, bizarrely enough, being something I have actually heard tankies on Lemmy espouse. Apparently the whole fascist conception of a “third way” was lost on them - or worse, appears appealing.
You could just as easily say “Liberals are morons who have the right intentions (democracy) but the wrong idea how to get it (capitalism)”
Tankies are dumbasses who simp for dictators, liberals have more intelligence but apply it incorrectly.
Honestly, fair.
Most liberals are liberal for lack of a better idea. Most liberals have not even been exposed to serious conceptions of socialism. If given the choice between fighting with liberals or fighting with tankies to see the point of a democratic and socialist society, liberals are by far the easier fight.
For that matter, if given the choice between fighting with a liberal regime, whose insufficient opposition to authoritarianism is likely to result in an eventual capitulation to fascism; or a tankie regime, which is and has its goal as fascism painted red; the former is much easier to fight and organize in.
Of those two choices - and the real world is not composed of such a binary - I would argue, albeit admittedly as a demsoc rather than an outright anarchist - that anarchists, whom I disagree with moderately at most, shouldn’t have anything in common with fucking tankies, who are despicable. If ‘opposition to capitalism’ is a valid point of ‘agreement’ then, as I pointed out, literal fascist regimes are no less ‘allies’ in that conception in contrast to the liberal menace.